The State Of U.S. Yacht Refit

The American yacht refit market is getting called “soft” more often lately, and we wanted to talk about what that actually means when you’re running projects, advising owners, or trying to keep a yard busy year-round. From the Palm Beach Boat Show, host Kristina Hebert digs into the signals being seen on the ground and in the headlines, and why a slowdown can also be a moment to reset the story and the strategy.

Kristina Hebert is joined by Diane Byrne of MegaYacht News and Patrick Knowles of Patrick Knowles Design to compare the U.S. and Europe, including how “refit” gets defined and why that definition matters for owners, advisors, and the wider superyacht industry. The trio gets practical about what drives long-term competitiveness for American refit shipyards, especially in South Florida and other waterfront hubs: steady project flow, clearer messaging, and confidence that the skilled labor is there when timelines get tight.

From maritime prosperity zones to protecting the working waterfront, they explore how policy and planning can support yacht refit and repair businesses before development pressure erases the space the industry needs to operate. The conversation zooms in on the biggest constraint of all: the next generation of marine trades. Welding, electrical, joinery, and every hands-on specialty are the backbone of refit, and we talk about apprenticeships, vocational programs, and the simple power of telling craftspeople’s stories with consistency and pride.

If you care about the future of American yacht refit, listen through and join the conversation. Subscribe to the Wards Way Podcast, share this with someone in the marine industry, and leave a review!

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Transcript

Welcome From Palm Beach

SPEAKER_03 0:03

Welcome to the Wards Way Podcast. We're here at the Palm Beach International Podcast, and I'm here with two wonderful friends. I have Diane Burns with Mega Yacht News, and I have Patrick Knowles with Patrick Knowles Design. Thank you both for being here, and this is such a great discussion because we are just here to talk about refit in America. And I think that's been a very big popular topic. I know we've all been going to various seminars here at the show and meeting with builders, but I really wanted to talk about with both of you, given that your experience, both you, Diane, and the media, and all the coverages that you that you do, and Patrick, boots in the ground and on board the boats with partners all over the world. What are we seeing in the refit market in the US? Let's talk about it.

Why The U.S. Refit Market Softens

SPEAKER_04 0:44

Patrick, why don't you start since you're more boots on the ground?

SPEAKER_00 0:46

We're we're most certainly seeing a soft market, and it seems to be coming a little bit softer. But I do not see that as the end of the road. I see it as kind of a marker in the road that we have uh good options for recovery. Um I think that there are a lot of people who may be concerned in the industry, but I think that we need positivity and we need to look at all of the tools that we have to help um to uh bring the the refit market um where it was uh and it's heyday, that would be amazing. Uh I think it's possible. And I just want to talk about what your thoughts are on it too.

SPEAKER_03 1:22

Sure, and and and let's talk about positivity from from the media side because our are we in trouble? We're in a soft market, but but I've heard you know other articles that say, you know, we're really in some trouble. Talk about it from a media

Media Signals And Europe’s Refit Momentum

SPEAKER_03 1:35

perspective.

SPEAKER_04 1:35

What are your you know it's interesting because from the 30,000 foot view, let's start there. The 30,000 foot view for the American market is there perception-wise, because that that's what I rely on. I rely on the news coming into my inbox. So perception-wise, there's not a lot going on in comparison to Europe. Europe, it sounds like people are firing on all cylinders. We get press releases constantly about either a refit job starting, a refit job completing, and and really the word refit is being used very broadly. A lot of times it's really not a refit, it was a repaint or a uh a 10-year survey or something. And I'm not discounting the amount of work that has to go into it, but that's not really a refit, that's service in general. But truly, there are there's far more news coming to us in the media and my colleagues across the media landscape compared to the US. So that is definitely a challenge, and that I think is also a reality, unfortunately, of what is going on in the US.

SPEAKER_03 2:39

So perhaps it's the media influencing, you know, some of the soft market, but the reality is there are boats being refit outside of the US. And I I think that um our position in a market, I know obviously my company doing electric, but um the US has always been known at for being the the champions of refit, and that's been our um position in the market, I think, for a very long time. The greatest concentration of services here, especially in South Florida, the Tri-County area, you know, the 138,000 jobs and $18 billion economic impact. But but we do see that I I believe that um similar to what Patrick is saying, that it's soft, but there are positives and there are positive things going on that are that are helping to kind of re-resteer that, so to speak.

Maritime Prosperity Zones And Opportunity

SPEAKER_03 3:21

And one we were talking about legislatively, um, maritime prosperity zones, that is something that um our government is looking at in ways to improve American shipbuilding, and we want that to include yachting. What are you guys' thoughts on that?

SPEAKER_04 3:34

I think it's a great idea because first of all, you look at all the refit shipyards that we have. Welding is welding, electrical is electrical. It doesn't matter whether it's a government yacht or it's a a yacht, I'm assuming a government vessel or a yacht. If it has a steel hull, if it has an aluminum hull, it's the same type of welding. So the same craftspeople are more than qualified to be doing that kind of work, and that's what the prosperity zones are supposed to be celebrating the American craftsmanship and that hands-on ability that has always been a hallmark of the United States working uh workforce.

SPEAKER_03 4:10

Absolutely, I agree. Now, interior design might be difficult on government vessels and uh and and military, but I but please, your

Workforce Reality And Trade Shortages

SPEAKER_03 4:19

thoughts.

SPEAKER_00 4:19

Um yes, I I think that this um program uh could be very beneficial for the private sector, the luxury yacht and industry. And one of the things from my standpoint is that whenever we sign a project, um, we analyze what what is it going to take to produce it, uh, not only in bandwidth as far as the design and technicality of it, but who whose hands are we going to be using to get it done? And you know, today I I think we're fine with if we were to get sizable refits, multiple yards. I think that for sure we can sustain that as it is now. Um however, uh one of the things that I have been paying attention to for quite a while, especially in visiting uh different countries and seeing how they treat labor. And here in the US, um, I think that we need some sort of an initiative, and I'm sure there are some that's ready in the works, um, that would uh help learn in institutions to maybe inculcate some of the expertise that we need in building these yachts. Uh, not everybody wants to sit at a desk or sit at a computer. We really need hands to build, we need welders, we need uh journalen, we need um electricians, we need all of these different traits. And um I think now in this renaissance, if we could call it, uh if we'd be so fortunate to have a renaissance, that maybe this would be the impetus to be able to look at, well, we're here now. You know, I'm basically in the September or October of my career, right? So uh when that December comes, you know, who's in March? Who's in April? So we we need to be conscious of that because that's real and that time comes quickly, and uh you cannot grow a vegetable garden overnight. So this is stuff that will take time. So from that to answer your question, uh it would tr it would protect and serve the luxury yacht and industry quite well if we could get that preserve preservation waterfront uh secured. Then that way that would give us the ability that if there is property that's suitable from our sector, the the luxury sector, then we're not um concerned during negotiations or even when a company or an entity is thinking about it, that they're going to lose it to a developer. That's that's real as well.

SPEAKER_03 6:37

So you touched on something on protecting our waterfront, and I think that that's the goal on these uh maritime prosperity zones for the for the recreational industry is to is to protect this working waterfront to make sure that it is still viable for it to be a place to have boats come and have that work. But even more so, it sounds like what we should also do is working on a campaign. How do we, if we want to hire the next generation of refit workers, and I love that we just coined the Refit Renaissance. You heard it here. It's happening. That is absolutely gonna be on a hat. We're we're entering the Refit Renaissance. But we we need to show kids the future that say, you know, we're building for your future. Please invest, please, please, you know, be looking at this, do the internships. Right. How can the media maybe help with that and and how can our businesses, you know, feed that information? Because I think it's important to talk about that next generation.

Apprenticeships And Youth Programs That Work

SPEAKER_04 7:29

Yeah, for one, I'm glad you both have brought that up because I was at a US Super Yacht Association visit out west in the Pacific Northwest a couple years ago. And we had the opportunity to hear from some individuals who created a phenomenal program to teach high school students about welding, electrical, et cetera, and the the marine traits, expose them to it, get them to understand it, and that way, as you so eloquently put it, that March you know generation is is coming. There are certainly some schools that are involved thanks to the Marine Industries Association of South Florida. I'm happy to say that in my area in Southwest Florida, I'm in Punta Gorda, just about maybe two or three months ago, the county announced a vocational type of program that they're going to be rolling out to the local schools. Now, aerospace is a big part of it, and I think that's phenomenal. But I would like to see them add marine trades. So I'm actually going to be reaching out to them and saying, listen, you're you're focusing on aerospace and you're focusing focusing on aviation because there's a lot of private aviation in the area. This is the waterfront. This is a magnificent boating community. They always talk about it anyway from a tourism standpoint. So marine trades is a huge part of making that tourism sustainable.

SPEAKER_03 8:47

I think there's always been, so I do want to go back to the marine industries has an apprenticeship program and MIASF and the and they have that, and and they're feeding into various jobs and getting kids at younger ages and in the high school to think about a different different type of type of career, and there are that. Also, I wanted to say there's Captain Sandy's charities. Yes. Um I just participated, uh, the our awards team participated with Quantum at the spin-a-thon, which was such a great another uh opportunity. So they did a spin-a-thon to support those charities, and that charity is all about educating the whole next generation from kindergarten through twelfth grade about the yachting industry and all the various ways that that you can get involved. So I think some of those are building that January, February, March.

SPEAKER_00 9:30

Exactly.

Rebuilding Pride In Skilled Trades

SPEAKER_00 9:31

Yeah. But you know, um, there's a comment that I'd like to make.

SPEAKER_03 9:33

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 9:34

And Diane, before we started the podcast, we were speaking about unity and message, right? And it doesn't matter if it's the marine industry, the aerospace industry, automotive build-in, it doesn't matter. Messaging is messaging. Right. And you have a much greater outcome when you have a unified message. And um I would say that having the initiatives where you have apprenticeship programs, that's good. And people like you, uh you're you're the megaphone, not only to the industry, but you could be the megaphone to all of those that we need to say, let's look in in that direction, let's look to the March generation, right? And um so messaging is important. And where I feel uh that we not as a marine industry, but maybe societally, uh, where we miss that message is that unfortunately um trades um have been or tradesmanship has been demonized in the advent of of TikTok, and before that it was uh Instagram and you go back and you go back and it was YouTube and you know, all of these things that kind of obscured the the viability of trades and tradesmanship, supporting families and supporting them well. And um there is nothing to be ashamed of or to look down on when you think about being a tradesman, because it doesn't matter where you are in that chain, the executive that's on the top of the the building, uh he's there because there were people that built where he is physically at. So having craftsmanship and tradesmanship, the messaging needs to be there's dignity, there's respect in that. And I think for a moment that may have been a little bit overcast. So yeah, curriculum and changing that narrative, um, because it's embryonic, we would have to start from the foundation up if we're going to have young children buying into it because we're going to have to entice them over TikTok or whatever else is going to come.

SPEAKER_04 11:39

Right.

Human Stories Behind Great Refit Work

SPEAKER_04 11:40

I want to build on that for a second because when I talk to the people who manage the shipyards, when I go to visit the shipyards, they talk, they take us all the way through the entire yard. So we're not just seeing the boats being built, we're seeing whether it's welders or it's uh fiberglass layers, it's the journey people. They take us through every single department, and oftentimes we get to talk to somebody who's at work, they'll pause and they'll answer a couple of questions for all of us crazy journalists. We'll pepper them with questions. Some of them kind of sit there like, oh God, I wasn't prepared for this. But the the point is that we're always so curious, like, how did you get to do, how did you become a joiner? How did you become a welder? And oftentimes it's this family story. It's oh well, my dad worked here, or my uncle worked here, I'm the second generation, I'm the third generation. Those are the stories I want to encourage every and any yacht builder, every and any refit shipyard, every and any supplier who is listening right now to tell that story. I can only do so much and I can only be in so many places. Same thing for my writers. And if I had that magic wand, man, we'd be everywhere. And I'd be getting all those stories, and nobody else would have them, right? But the entire media landscape needs those stories, and we can't all be everywhere at once. So we need everybody to kind of think a little bit more from that standpoint, tell that human interest story. The yacht launching, the yacht coming in for service is important, but the craftspeople are also such a vital part of that story. And I do see it sometimes in the press releases we get when there's a yacht being launched, whether it's again a new build or a refit, there'll be a paragraph about how all the craftspeople and their families were invited, and then the owners will say special thanks to all of them. And it is from the bottom of their heart. I've attended some of these ceremonies, and they are just so happy, and they're greeting, they're shaking their hands vigorous, so like thank you, thank you, thank you. Those are the stories we need more of.

SPEAKER_00 13:44

Yeah, I I I would agree. And were you gonna say something?

SPEAKER_03 13:48

No, it's okay. Keep going.

SPEAKER_00 13:49

I I would say in in traveling to foreign countries uh and having projects in different areas, um you in in many cultures uh having multi-generational um traits under one roof or in one lineage, you know, the think about the automotive industry and in Detroit, um, grandfathers, fathers, grandsons, that sort of thing. And um we do not see that as much anymore. And I think as you're saying, um that's a big part of the message, and because I, you know, it's great having technology, right? And we're all excited when we experience new technology, but that luster wears off after a while. And I think on a more systemic and holistic capacity, I think in time, um technology is going to wear off. And people are going to realize that there's a lot of depth to technology, but what technology does not replace and will never substitute are the emotions that we have and the connections that we have with one another, but specifically with family. And so I think that there may come a time where it will be very appealing to young people to say that yes, I'm doing what my father did, what my grandfather did. We do not have that. And I think it's unfortunately going to take a little bit of realization when the glamour and glitter of um this IT and this AI um world wears thin. Uh so again, now renaissance, right? So now is the time to start um planning uh the the this the strategy of how we're going to conquer and succeed at the end result, which is bringing that um March and April generation to fruition. There's so many things that need to be worked on, other than the math of what it can earn for you, other than the security that it can give you, other than the location of where it would be. But most importantly, how is it going to improve my life and potentially my family life if you begin to follow in the footsteps of maybe an uncle, maybe it's an aunt, you know, it doesn't have to be the the father or the mother, but the point is generational and having some sort of sort of tether that would um to where that craftsmanship can be carried in a lineage, and I think that's important. So I'm I'm being hopeful that we would see a time when people really begin to long for being involved in their nine to five, if you would, that has more significant and personal meaning.

Generational Companies And Communication Gaps

SPEAKER_03 16:24

Well, I I I feel like this is such a great moment to introduce you all to the Ward's Way and the Wards Way podcast, and thank you both. But I have to say that um we are those people that uh as a third generation, I I have to say we exist. I have um multiple generations that work for me. In fact, our um our Riviera Beach and our operations manager's father retired in 2017, who would work for us for 31 years, and Jason has worked for us for 30 years. Um but we are are very unique in that, and um I think a lot of what it comes down to is yachting and boating is looked at as a lifestyle versus an industry. And and the lifestyle is wonderful, but there's an industry behind it.

SPEAKER_01 17:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:08

And so creating those spaces and creating places, um, you know, that that boat doesn't travel at sea well without all of the craftsmen that that are behind it, and so I think we just need to kind of maybe focus a little bit on that, but we don't really talk about the generational stories. I feel like sometimes I am at times a unicorn in the room, but then I start talking to people, and um I have been humbled so much in a in in the last year, just interviewing different people and why why the old third generation, I mean, we cannot be as boring, you know, there's no circuit breakers in our booth right here, but we are trying to embrace technology to get that message out as a as a 76-year-old family business. But one thing I've learned is that there are so many businesses that are out there that do have that, but they don't talk about that. Yeah. Because what they're talking about is what they produced or the projects that they're on, and and that's the focus, and you're right, it needs to be how did they get to there to get to be a part of that huge refit? What went into that? What is the generational, the decades, the uncle that worked there? You just don't talk about that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:10

No, I I I think it's important. Can I say something? You can say anything you want to do. I don't want to hostage anything. Um, but how remiss of me, and I'm not intending for this part to be, that we didn't, we're speaking about generational stuff, but we're sitting in front of can I say something? Okay, and you could splice this in however, or you could say it, is you know, we're speaking about generational stuff, and I mean sitting in our midst. We have Christina Ward's Marina Letter. I mean, you're a fine example of that. And um, maybe you could give us a little bit of insight on that, and you already spoke about all of it.

SPEAKER_03 18:46

Well, I I just think that it's funny because you all know that, but yet it's just kind of a given in my story. But maybe I'm not talking about it in other words. I think it's two-way. No, no, no, no, no, no. I think it's both.

SPEAKER_00 18:58

No, it's good.

SPEAKER_03 18:59

I like this.

SPEAKER_02 18:59

Yeah, it's exactly what you just identified.

SPEAKER_00 19:02

Because you not saying it doesn't prompt me to recognize something that I, or yeah, to recognize or to acknowledge something that I know. I mean, here we are.

SPEAKER_03 19:11

You did know it, and and you congratulated me and you were there on my 75th, but this is right here. No, and I get it, I know, but at some level, it's like, but we do exist, right? We maybe are not doing as good of a job of putting it out there.

SPEAKER_02 19:24

Right.

SPEAKER_04 19:25

So this this is the this is the challenge, and it's part of the renaissance. Right. No, this is I it's part of the renew, it's part of the renaissance, but this is the communication challenge that is across every single industry. It's not just the marine industry. People are so accustomed to working in their business that when it comes to working on the business, which is the communications, the marketing, et cetera, they forget about it, they forget about those those stories. Those stories to them are like breathing.

SPEAKER_03 19:59

No, it's just we don't have time because we are a small business, and you're right, it's just what we do.

SPEAKER_04 20:03

It's what they do, exactly. So it doesn't occur to them, it's the it's the wow factor stuff that, oh, that's what we need to publicize. But what they don't think is the wow factor is still the wow factor.

SPEAKER_03 20:13

It's the people, because or I'll feel like, you know, you don't need to sit and talk about yourself all the time, or you don't necessarily want to, as they say, toot your own horn. But in in cases like this where we are talking about the American refit market, I believe that there are many, and I've met them. In fact, in Miami, you know, I sat with um Chrissy Hughes, and and she's uh celebrating Hughes Boats. She's fifth generation on a hundredth anniversary. And and and um they're a customer of ours, but I got a chance to sit with her and then I could name them and keep going. And I do think that we need to really pull that together, and maybe instead of working on, not instead of, in addition to, apprenticeship, that we really do focus on that generational and talk about family businesses and generational businesses and also generational businesses that sometimes maybe it breaks from the family, but they keep, they they keep the same principles and and they're still keeping the longevity of the company. I'll give an example, for example, DIFE, which is a power management company, Denmark Electric Instrument Factory is the acronym. Um, they've been a family business for for many, many years, decades, and they have for the first time have a CEO that is not a family member, but he doesn't know that because he's worked there his whole life. And in his mind, he is the family. And I can tell you, I can point to my wards family, and there are many people that I consider family that maybe we weren't aren't related, but but we are. And so I think there's other options for these family businesses that maybe it can't go to the cousin or the niece or the or the son or daughter. But you know what? I bet there's people in that business who built it and are part of the family, and we can focus even on that. I think that some of that's there. So America has these generational businesses, but maybe we're not doing the right communication. Or working collectively with the shipyards.

SPEAKER_00 22:02

You know, something out of the box as you were speaking and so stated so well is that, Diane, to you, uh, speaking to the media, speaking to the mouthpiece for the industry and beyond, is that we we were speaking about earlier we were speaking about um uh federations. I don't know if we want to mention that word, but we were speaking about um uh companies coming together for a better good, right? We're we're we're much better in our sum than we are in in our individuality. Um so I mean, I I think that story that you said, I think it would be great if we had a unification and some capacity to where it's not Maggiecht news or it's not this news or whatever.

SPEAKER_03 22:44

Or Wards or Patrick Knowles.

SPEAKER_00 22:46

It's it's right, but from a media standpoint, is that you have a common uh department or what would you call that segment in your news. All of you, it's the same thing. And you invite an audience that in the first week of the month upload up to a five-minute video or interview with somebody in your company, but it has to meet this criteria. So that if everybody has it, because it takes a village to raise a kid, if everybody has it and it's not um it's not owned or it's not anybody's idea, it's an outlet or a multiple outlet through the media that this room, whatever you want to call it, put a name on it. Put a name on it that's nasty and people can relate to and people understand and say, you know what, you're you've been in my company for X amount of years, and your aunt just uh retired. So let's uh for for March or whatever, July, I would like to do an interview with you and we'd upload it and see who picks it up, or it just goes and you know, I think it's going to take more than the Christine Awards to um get the megaphone and mention it because it's really only going to meet um a smaller audience. Whereas whereas if we had a platform, but the key of it is is we have a unified systemic um coalition, culture, culture in the media for this purpose. It's the American lineage of craftsmanship, and we have it, and um we've we've not we we want to spotlight it, we want to bring it to everybody's attention.

How To Pitch Media The Right Way

SPEAKER_04 24:28

Right, right. The way to do it from a media standpoint is really first and foremost take a look at the landscape because not every media outlet is the same. Some some are say 100% focused on the American market, some have a partial focus on the American market, then you have to see, okay, who's B2B and who's B2C, because there's different ways to tell the stories. You can still tell that story, but it has to be tailored for the audience. That's one of the things that I see, unfortunately, that does not happen. There's a a press release that's overly broad sent out, or it's very technical, even to another degree, sent out to all of us. We're not a technical media outlet. We're talking to the owners and their advisors, not really the captains. We're talking to the advisors who are the family office managers, some of the people who maybe also be project managers, but more of the less technical individuals. So if you send me something that's all about ISO or about um power management. Yeah, power management. I I read some of it, I'm like, that's really cool, but I can't get my audience for the life of me to be interested in it. And it pains me sometimes because there's good information I want them to know, but they are who they are. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 25:44

But let's do it here. Let's come up with a couple bullet points because unfortunately I know everybody has to get back to their clients. Refit renaissance. What are what are what are let's let's let's make our top five bullet points right now. We have communication, spotlight, education, consistency.

SPEAKER_04 25:59

It's consistency, it's consistent communication. It doesn't have to be every week, it doesn't have to be every other week, just even once a month. Just make sure, boom, boom, boom, boom. Tell your story. Yes, tell your story 100%. Tell your story, even the the smallest story that you don't think is a big deal is a big deal.

SPEAKER_03 26:18

I agree. And and how do they send you those press releases?

SPEAKER_04 26:21

Our address is info at megayachtnews.com. If you don't know how to reach somebody, you go to their website. There's usually a general info at or editor at kind of inbox, even social media. Do a direct message through their social media channels. The social media team often will talk to the editors and say, hey, we just got this inquiry. How do you guys want to handle it? It's super easy.

Unified Voice And Closing Takeaways

SPEAKER_03 26:42

Federations, can we talk about that at the American Voting Congress, which is in the first week of May?

SPEAKER_00 26:47

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 26:48

Brought to us by the National Marine Manufacturers Association, but also many associations, U.S. Super Yacht, MISF, MIA Palm Beach, all attend. And I think we can talk about these maritime prosperity zones, but from a recreational, maybe we talk about federation. Yes. Unified voice.

SPEAKER_00 27:03

Yes, I think so. I I think that some entities may uh have to look at um consolidation or partnering to some capacity or in some capacity and bring in the strengths that they both have to create a whole. And uh I think that would give us the um leverage and the cutting edge or cut-in advantage or competitive advantage to be able to start bringing in significant and meaningful uh meaningful work, not that we don't have it, but I think to have more consistent uh and and even if if we are busy, it's it's never a bad thing to have more work and have a consistent message.

SPEAKER_03 27:43

And the the Refit Renaissance was born here today. Thank you both, thank you both for being here, and thank you for your successful Palm Beach Boat Show.

SPEAKER_00 27:52

And likewise.

SPEAKER_03 27:53

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 27:55

Thanks for joining us. Make sure you subscribe to the Wards Way podcast. We're just getting started.